hurricanemk1c 195 Posted April 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 I found it on Facebook (there's a page that I have liked which gives a lot of useless info + pictures like this - a lot of my 'This Day in History' comes from this artist) - any more guesses? Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 I wonder if the Russians got hold of this drawing, the TU95 looks almost identical apart from those wing tanks and the cockpit layout. Though THAT aircraft was apparently an evolution of the B29/TU4 airframe.........But then they would say that if they were protecting a scource of espionage wouldn't they! makes you wonder! Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Ok, so the winner was the Convair B-36 'Peacemaker'.....making the other aircraft the Boeing xxx.....? I can only find a reference to Boeing being the only other manufacturer to submit a design. As this had been a protracted development, it started as the Consolidated B-36 before the merger with Vultee to become Convair in 1943. Still looking!!! Link to post Share on other sites
allardjd 1,853 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 "two turning, two burning, two smoking, two joking, and two more unaccounted for." Now that's pretty funny, and mostly true for the B-36. The radials in particular were hugely unreliable and suffered from cooling problems. John Link to post Share on other sites
hurricanemk1c 195 Posted April 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 The winner of the competition was indeed the B-36, but it beat a Douglas project. A interesting snippit from www.airspacemag.com , which has a lot of detail on the aircraft: In place of the parasite fighters, large underwing drop tanks and special-purpose pods could be substituted to provide, according to the Douglas proposal, "extreme versatility in operations." Douglas engineers imagined pods—"droppable or not as desired," the proposal states—that could carry reconnaissance or radar equipment, countermeasures, even personnel to supplement the bomber's nine-man crew. One drawing shows the pods in a photo-reconnaissance configuration, complete with cameras and even a small film-processing lab. Without the parasites, the Douglas bomber could defend itself with a choice of radar-controlled 20-mm cannon or Hughes MX-904 self-guided missiles, stored in an internal rotary launcher like an oversized Colt six-shooter. The Douglas team had also proposed droppable takeoff gear positioned under the outer section of the aircraft's enormous wings. "Using droppable gear is always a last resort," says Boyne. "The B-52 had retractable tip gear, which was a heavier but more sensible solution." Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 The Douglas 1211-J...hmmm...the "Do Everything" bomber. A difficult one to research and certainly when there is conflicting data (not that that's your fault Kieran). A great challenge. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Sure was an ambitious project, I'd never have found this thing. Nice one Kieran. http://www.airspacemag.com/history-of-flight/The-Do-Everything-Bomber.html?c=y&page=1 Link to post Share on other sites
hurricanemk1c 195 Posted April 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Correct Andrew - the orginal post I'm sure said that it was in competition with the B-36. It was, to a certain extent, when the B-36G Swept-wing version and the B-52 went head-to-head. Interesting aircraft! Link to post Share on other sites
hurricanemk1c 195 Posted April 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Forgot to mention - this is the page I found it on - The Chicken Works: The Aviation Art of J.P. Santiago Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Kieran, A great challenge mate, probably the best one yet. The added challenge was trying to source reliable and credible research data to match your clues. Douglas weren't known for designing heavy or strategic bombers, with the exception of the XB-19, so that confused things a tad. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 18, 2013 Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Kieran, A great challenge mate, probably the best one yet. The added challenge was trying to source reliable and credible research data to match your clues. Douglas weren't known for designing heavy or strategic bombers, with the exception of the XB-19, so that confused things a tad. Cheers Andrew The XB-19 was the only big Douglas project I could find as well. Boeing did propose a turboprop aircraft when designing the B-52 but it was felt a pure jet would be the preferred way to go. Nice challenge mate. Link to post Share on other sites
brett 2,314 Posted April 19, 2013 Report Share Posted April 19, 2013 Good one Kieran Didn't have a clue. Kudos to Andrew for tracking it down Wonder what this model would go for on the open market. Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 OK guys, let's give this one a try. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 It looks de havillandish! Link to post Share on other sites
rob16584 42 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 I thought that, but couldn't find anything on the first go Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 Almost certainly DH Gipsy series engines.......or something very similar. I thought they may be german Argus units at first but the air intakes are the wrong shape. Link to post Share on other sites
allardjd 1,853 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 Seems vaguely German to me... John Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 20, 2013 Report Share Posted April 20, 2013 Not an early Siebel 204 by any chance? Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Not a de Havilland or German design of any type, and the engines are not de Havilland Gipsy engines of any variant either. However, the engines are a "minor" by name and were manufactured in a different country to the aircraft. The aircraft came in six very different variants, all using the same basic model number. Two variants broke world airspeed records in 1957 and 1960 in their respective classes. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
allardjd 1,853 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Is it a Czech Let Aero AE 45? Can't find an exact match but it's in the ball park. John Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Sorry John, not the AE 45. However, it uses the same engine on one of the variants, as far as my research indicates. Whilst the engines were manufactured in Czechoslovakia, the aircraft wasn't. In its heyday, and among other designs, the company built a well known British fighter of the 1930's and a British light bomber of the early WWII period under licence. The company still exists today, but no longer produces aircraft. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Is it an RWD-11 ? Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Sorry Alan, not the RWD-11, but like John's guess, we are getting closer, geographically speaking. The RWD-11 had a Walter Major engine, whereas this aircraft variant used a Walter Minor engine (or two to be exact). There are a few more clues I can give that should really focus everyone's research. However, I will give it another day to see what the others can come up with. Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 Would it be the Ikarus 451 ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Avion_451_Slika2.JPG Link to post Share on other sites
Andrew Godden 943 Posted April 21, 2013 Report Share Posted April 21, 2013 So much for the extra day and clues, Alan. The Ikarus 451 it is and odd in that the pilot lay prone in the cockpit. I'm on my iPad so I can't post the other shots, but I'll do that tomorrow. How did you finally work it out? Cheers Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
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