J G 927 Posted July 14, 2014 Report Share Posted July 14, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28299334 Looks like Putinist Russia may be on the brink again. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
dodgy-alan 1,587 Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 What with Ukraine, Syria, Iraq and Egypt it looks like the whole of the area is about to implode and will take everyone else down with it. What kind of world our children and grandchildren will grow up in I dread to think. Link to post Share on other sites
J G 927 Posted July 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 I guess it is not as bad as the Cuban missile crisis, least ways not yet. Link to post Share on other sites
ddavid 149 Posted July 15, 2014 Report Share Posted July 15, 2014 What with Ukraine, Syria, Iraq and Egypt it looks like the whole of the area is about to implode and will take everyone else down with it. What kind of world our children and grandchildren will grow up in I dread to think. Not to mention Gaza... Did someone say something about a hand-basket? Cheers - Dai. Link to post Share on other sites
allardjd 1,853 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 I don't worry too much about Gaza. The Palestinians continue to insist upon attacking Israel's fist with their face, throwing unguided missiles and mortar rounds indiscriminately. Iron Dome, Patriot and the still-under-development Arrow are/will provide a reasonably effective umbrella as Israel uses its military in a campaign to degrade the rocket launching capability of Hamas. Hamas can't win, but continue to willingly sacrifice their people, combatants and civilians, for no more than what they consider good publicity. I'm much more concerned about the Iran nuclear weapons issue and what Israel may choose to do about that. Israel probably sees a nuclear Iran as an existential threat and will act accordingly. I sincerely hope they can find a way to assure themselves that they can do the job by non-nuclear, conventional or covert means. If they can't, and if their allies continue to fiddle while the centrifuges turn, I feel certain that Israel will go nuclear against Iran. Nobody wins, but Israel survives. Given the situation, it may turn out to be the best of a very poor set of options for Israel. Though Iran has a burgeoning missile program, I expect that if they achieve a nuclear capability their chosen delivery vehicle will be a shipping container. That's much more their style. Israel cannot be expected to sit still and wait for that to happen. John Link to post Share on other sites
ddavid 149 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Not many worry about Gaza, John - let's face it, it's only a 8 by 30 mile bomb-site, after all. That it contains nearly 2 million people, mostly refugees, is not important, either. Of these, 200, or so, have been killed since the recent kidnapping, whilst 1 Israeli has died with shrapnel injuries. When you compare Gaza's weapons, mortars and rockets, with Israel's, it's hardly surprising that so many have been killed. What is surprising is that the world watches and does nothing. You can tell that my feelings are not entirely pro Zionist. Like many, I suffer from the problem of being labelled anti Semitic - far from it, as I believe every one deserves human rights. Unfortunately, that view doesn't seem to hold in the Knesset. Anyway - nuff said. I don't want to draw anyone into this quagmire, so thanks for reading this. Cheers - Dai. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
J G 927 Posted July 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 I think the US has a different outlook on the Palestine/Israel situation than us in Europe. I get the impression that the USA comes down on the side of Israel, where we in Europe see things differently. Most people I know think that the Israelis are just as much to blame as the Palestinians. The conflict will rumble on until one side learns to turn the other cheek. It is clear to us in Europe that the only way to settle this will be the creation of a recognized Palestinian state, one that Israel fully respects. There is one other thing that I personally feel. I have visited Dachau concentration camp, and seen first hand a place where unspeakable oppression of the Jews was carried out. The feeling of oppression and evil is still palpable. So, given this level of suffering and the fact that it is such a part of Jewish history, I don't understand why the same people treat the Palestinians as they do. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
britfrog 180 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 if any of you have read the 7 pillars of wisdom by TE Lawrence you will know that nobody hates an arab more than his arab neighbour. The original promised land of cain and able was located in ethiopia it was a decision of total ignorance and stupidity to let the jews have israel here it is currently located , thank you lord balfour i hope you sleep well in your grave. If they had been given ethiopia the only people with a problem would be a country of half starved africans, no problem, but no we gave them the land they now occupy surrounded by arabs, talk about red ragging the bull. there will be only one solution to this problem that is the nuking of israel and the israelis know it , hence they do not want their neighbours to have the bomb. However with the current unrest in russia it is probably a lot easier to buy a bomb than make it , the nuclear power station is just a side event which israel uses as a reason to kill innoicent people, something they were always so verbal against when they were on the receiving end in russia and other countries where they were 3rd class citizens. Link to post Share on other sites
jaydor 345 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 What do we expect different from the middle east, where western interference of a culture that is 400 years behind western culture. Remember it is not people who cause wars, but politicians together with religious leaders, who seek power and that strange idea of fame. Blair, Bush and other western idiots are to blame for the mess we are seeing at the moment. Middle eastern culture is still based on tribalism and that is prominent with the Sunni and Sh'ite or shity's as we old soldiers knew them by, are doing to each other at the moment. Putting the idea of nuclear technologies and AK45's into the hands of a culture that is still in a state of barbaric tribal conflict, is what we ultimately will be rewarded with soon, the harvest of greedy arms investment and interference.. One of the difficulties of trying to solve the middle east conflicts is the notion "of saving face" All sides will only agree to anything that allows each to "save face".. Me? I save with the Woolwich.. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
allardjd 1,853 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 ...let's face it, it's only a 8 by 30 mile bomb-site, after all. Actually, it's an 8 by 30 mile rocket and mortar launching site, controlled at least partially by an organization that has publicly pledged to obliterate and utterly destroy Israel, and which deliberately sites it's weapons in close proximity to civilian residences, religious sites, schools, medical facilities, etc. The Israeli PM recently contrasted his strategies against those of Hamas - "We use our missiles to protect our citizens. Hamas uses its citizens to protect its missiles." - or words to that effect. Israel accepted the proposed cease fire yesterday and stood down for six hours, during which time Hamas rejected the cease fire and continued to shell Israel. They launched the equivalent of one rocket every six minutes. What exactly would you have them do in the face of the ongoing attacks? John Link to post Share on other sites
britfrog 180 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 I would expect the israelis to do what they asked everyone else to do to them, ie turn the other cheek I well remember a great debate in which i took part back in uni " those that live by the sword will die by the sword" Link to post Share on other sites
J G 927 Posted July 16, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 I would expect the israelis to do what they asked everyone else to do to them, ie turn the other cheek I well remember a great debate in which i took part back in uni " those that live by the sword will die by the sword" turn the other cheek = Christian ethic. An eye for an eye = Jewish and Islamic ethic. Link to post Share on other sites
Captain Coffee 2,030 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 What can anyone expect from a civilization that began with Brother murdering Brother... according to their own mythology. Their first kingdom...David's, committed genocide against Goliath's people...and then it's second and last king sold off his people to slavery to afford to build his cedar pallace (even threatened to cut a child in half over a custody dispute...that incident sure got spun differently in the re-writes). I'm not anti-jewish....I just can read history and appreciate irony. Link to post Share on other sites
mutley 4,495 Posted July 16, 2014 Report Share Posted July 16, 2014 Thanks everyone for your considered thoughts. I am going to close this topic now as it is a very contentious issue better off debated on political forums not flight simulation forums, and I would hate it to get personal. Let's get back on topic... flight sim. Cheers, Joe 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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