how to remove info from a p.c. that wont boot up

[britfrog 180]

You all probably know this but it is a dodge that I have used on friends computers that have been disabled by a virus, or a boot sector problem

 

You can download a version of UBUNTU and put it on a USB memory stick and insert it into the usb socket , so that when you boot up the p.c. instead of letting it boot up as normal you hit F12 to get the boot menu and you tell it to boot from the USB  stick. ubuntu is a brilliant OS and doesnt suffer from the problems of windows, it boots up quickly recognises all your components and you can then download all the info that is important on your blocked/disabled hard drive instead of losing it, if you were about to format the disk to eradicate the virus that is.

[dogtrack 346]

Well, I didn't.....so thanks for the pointer Nigel. Have made a note in case the situation should arise.

[mutley 4,498]

Nice tip Nigel, thanks

[flybytes 34]

Nigel,

 

Another handy method of saving/retrieving data on an unbootable pc is to partition your c: drive & install another operating system on the new partition (when your pc is healthy).

 

At boot up you will be prompted to select which OS you require - sometimes useful if you have a 32-bit & 64-bit version of the same OS.

 

If one OS becomes unusable due to a virus, it's likely that the other will still be bootable & important files can be retrieved (as happened to me once).

 

Your method is safer, as there is a possibility that a virus may infect both partitions.

 

Ray.

[britfrog 180]

Thanks for that one Ray, although many of us are used to delving into the darkest corners of FSX , something simple like a corrupted boot sector may cause someone to panic and format a drive as they are unable to get online to seek help .

These little ideas might help someone when they least expect it, to retain things as mundane as family pics which might otherwise be lost.

[flybytes 34]

Nigel,

 

That was an extremely quick reply!

 

Of course the obvious method is to make regular backups, you can never have too many backups. Well run businesses always used the 'grandfather, father & son backups system' unless you were a government department - but... I won't go there.

 

With this new anti-secrecy legislation that Cameron & co are rushing through Parliament (does our parliament deserve a capital P?), are any of our data files or photos sacrosanct, curious, when in opposition, the Conservatives were so concerned about our civil liberties?

 

Talking about backups, why on earth would anyone want to save their private data in a 'Google or Microsoft Cloud', surely the 'Cloud' is a portion of the vast database the US NSA have on us all?

 

Ray.

 

[britfrog 180]

am I the only person in the world that has grave doubts about the security of our information that is stored on the cloud?

 

a few years ago we were told back up and back up as you say to your own drive which is totally inaccesible to anyone especially if the computer is turned off.

Now we are being told you must back up to the cloud as it is secure --- yeah right!! but whoever you back up with will disclaim any responsibility if your files are tampered with or destroyed.

for me the cloud is a non event full stop.

like gambling you only gamble with what you can afford to lose

[britfrog 180]

double post -Sorry

[Gunner 69]

am I the only person in the world that has grave doubts about the security of our information that is stored on the cloud?

 

a few years ago we were told back up and back up as you say to your own drive which is totally inaccesible to anyone especially if the computer is turned off.

Now we are being told you must back up to the cloud as it is secure --- yeah right!! but whoever you back up with will disclaim any responsibility if your files are tampered with or destroyed.

for me the cloud is a non event full stop.

like gambling you only gamble with what you can afford to lose

 

Totally agree on that. As you say, just a few years ago we spent money (and time) just to keep our data on the PC we use, and not let "go" anywere. Now..."all your settings and documents will backed up to the cloud"...god knows where. And this is "..enabled by default". OK, my first move was to disable that, but i bet that at least 50% of the new users don't.

[SEATAC 400]

That is a good tip. Thanks! Another method, which invollves opening your computer, is to remove the hard drive, and plug it into a USB to IDE/SATA adapter and attach it to another PC. You can then download everything that you need and wipe the rest and reformat the drive if you wish. The adapter provides power to the drive and plugs into your other PC via the USB port. My wife does freelance IT work and uses that alll the time for her clients who have crappy old computers that are upgrading or for systems that will no longer boot.

[allardjd 1,853]

Seatac's method is a very good one, and now with USB 3.0 devices available, an exterally connected drive doesn't have to plod along at USB 2.0 speeds. 

 

John

[flybytes 34]

Yet another method of insuring against a PC becoming unbootable, one which is freely available to anyone using a Microsoft OS which presumably includes everyone using an MS flight sim, is to make a recovery cd (or floppy if still using them).

 

Look in your windows help file to find out how to create one.

 

Like some of the other methods mentioned, a recovery disk created on one PC does work on other PC's, so if you have access to another computer, it is possible to create a disk after the horse has bolted.

 

Ray.

 

 

P.S.

 

anyone thinking that I don't know how to spell 'disc' should know that I use the 1960/1970's terminology of 'disk' which is any 'disc' shaped computer memory medium, as does 'b' refer to bits & 'B' refer to bytes which are often incorrectly misused these days.

 

[Ol_Grey_Beard 0]

With usb external hard drives of 2+ terabytes it is really easy to backup all your data. I have 2 and all my downloaded pay-ware and freeware files are saved in zip format with copies of serial numbers etc.

 

Clouds mean rain and water and computers don't mix!

 

Dave

[britfrog 180]

yes but an external hard drive is no use if the p.c. wont boot up

[ddavid 149]

Hi Dave - nice to have you aboard HMS Mutley's Hangar.

But, as Nigel says, a dead computer don't talk!

Hwyl - Dai.

[flybytes 34]

am I the only person in the world that has grave doubts about the security of our information that is stored on the cloud?

 

a few years ago we were told back up and back up as you say to your own drive which is totally inaccesible to anyone especially if the computer is turned off.

Now we are being told you must back up to the cloud as it is secure --- yeah right!! but whoever you back up with will disclaim any responsibility if your files are tampered with or destroyed.

for me the cloud is a non event full stop.

like gambling you only gamble with what you can afford to lose

 

In view of the recent hacking into the 'Cloud' resulting in very personal photos of celebs appearing on the Web, both Nigel's & my own fears about the 'Cloud' have been well founded!

 

Ray.

[SEATAC 400]

yes but an external hard drive is no use if the p.c. wont boot up

I beg to differ.  That is the whole reason to back up your data to an external hard drive.  If the pc is fried and you just cannot get it to boot, all of your data can then be transferred to a new pc.

Better yet, you can make an image of your current computer on an external hard drive so if your original hard drive bites the big one, all you gotta do is put in a new drive and then restore the image.

If the pc gets fried, buy a new pc and restore the image to the new pc.

I have an image of both my work and home computers on a 2TB external hard drive and periodically update the image.

IT departments make nightly backups of their servers.  If the drive then gets fried, they simply get a new drive and restore the data.

[SEATAC 400]

 

am I the only person in the world that has grave doubts about the security of our information that is stored on the cloud?

 

a few years ago we were told back up and back up as you say to your own drive which is totally inaccesible to anyone especially if the computer is turned off.

Now we are being told you must back up to the cloud as it is secure --- yeah right!! but whoever you back up with will disclaim any responsibility if your files are tampered with or destroyed.

for me the cloud is a non event full stop.

like gambling you only gamble with what you can afford to lose

 

Totally agree on that. As you say, just a few years ago we spent money (and time) just to keep our data on the PC we use, and not let "go" anywere. Now..."all your settings and documents will backed up to the cloud"...god knows where. And this is "..enabled by default". OK, my first move was to disable that, but i bet that at least 50% of the new users don't.

 

 

Cloud is just a media friendly term. All it is a computer sitting in a room somewhere connected to the internet.  Never, and I mean never put anything on the cloud that you want to keep private.  Storing music on it is about the only thing you should use the cloud for.  It can be hacked as easily as anything else.  The only safe way to backup or store anything is on an external hard drive or usb that you keep in your house.  And always remember to unplug it from your pc after you make the backup.  If you leave it plugged in then it is just as vulnerable to a lightning strike or power surge or hacking as is your computer itself.  Make your backup and unplug it until your next backup.

 

 

The problem is that the vast majority of people are very ignorant when it comes to computers.  They are very naïve and have no idea how they work or what the cloud is.  They just fall for all of the hype and convenience of the cloud.  Anyone who thinks that their texts or e-mails are private is living in a fantasy world.  There are copies of those out in cyberspace as well.

[flybytes 34]

Richard,

 

have to agree with you, the term 'Cloud' is very much an odd marketing expression, which actually scores an own goal - would anyone want to store their personal data in something so wispy which is here today and gone tomorrow?

 

I'm not or never will be a marketing guy, but if I were to give a name to a global data storage system, surely something more like 'Pyramid' or 'Stonehenge' would inspire more confidence - but then on the other hand, seeing the weather beaten state of them, perhaps not.

 

As you say the reality is thousands (if not millions) of hard drives probably mounted in 19" racks inside large brick or concrete purpose built buildings - not only an amateur hackers' dream, but the various security agencies around the world must be rubbing their hands with glee.

 

Ray.

[SEATAC 400]

Richard,

 

have to agree with you, the term 'Cloud' is very much an odd marketing expression, which actually scores an own goal - would anyone want to store their personal data in something so wispy which is here today and gone tomorrow?

 

I'm not or never will be a marketing guy, but if I were to give a name to a global data storage system, surely something more like 'Pyramid' or 'Stonehenge' would inspire more confidence - but the on the other hand, seeing the weather beaten state of them, perhaps not.

 

As you say the reality is thousands (if not millions) of hard drives probably mounted in 19" racks inside large brick or concrete purpose built buildings - not only an amateur hackers' dream, but the various security agencies around the world must be rubbing their hands with glee.

 

Ray.

 

Now that you mention it, maybe the marketing guys are smarter than we think they are.  Cloud is the perfect name for it. wispy and falls apart with the slightest breeze. No security whatsoever.  To name it something like you suggest or 'The Vault' would be misleading.

[flybytes 34]

Going back to the basics of this,

 

Like a diary, the only ways to protect your thoughts or personal data is to incinerate your diary, disk or usb memory stick - but the ultimate way is not to commit your thoughts to the World & become a hermit - the World will not advance, but at least we will all be sleeping easier in our beds and the lawyers & politicians will be struggling to find a way of making a living.

 

Ray.

 

[Quickmarch 488]

There was a time when I worked (telecommuted) out of my house on Vancouver Island. The work was all done using a CAD system and the back-up methods were:

 

1. RAID (Redundant Array of Independent Disk(s)) - mounted on the computer being used. This was for an immediate recovery if one of the disks went down while you were working. Basically, you had a mirror-image of everything that was done up to the last automatic write (every five minutes).

 

2. Optical connection to a server in Vancouver and, ultimately, to one of the corporate backup facilities buried in a chalk mine somewhere in California. The IT's took care of that part, however, I believe it was a daily backup. The "Last Mile" - connection to the fibre optic system from the house was accomplished  using a broadband (hard wired) cable-TV system. This was the only real insecure part of the whole system as it would have been possible, albeit improbable, for someone to physically intercept the signal before it got re-transmitted over the optics.

 

3. The disks in the computer were replaced every month by IT. What they did with them is not known to me.

 

We never lost anything.

 

Another take on the same subject is the need for us to understand exactly what happens when we write to a hard disk, using Windows technology. Everything you write to a disk remains on that disk ALMOST indefinitely. My understanding (and this could be old news) is that Windows simply overwrites the first character in the FAT when you erase. What this does is remove the file reference from the internal catalogue, NOT the file. Your files will eventually be over-written but it takes a long time. 

 

There are commercially available software packages that are designed to overwrite files with nonsense characters by detecting the actual location on disk where the information is stored and erase (overwrite) the whole thing.

 

[brett 2,315]

A Cloud, never!!!

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ushrLpVCRh0

[flybytes 34]

John,

 

I, worked with disk data memory systems developed in the 1950's & indeed some of the early mechanical & valves (double triodes, or tubes), computer devices, even some lesser known devices using decatrons, (so forgotten that this spellchecker does not recognise it or the lesser known alternate spelling of dekatron). Believe it or not but some quite sophistic, although slow & by todays standards, very unreliable, computers can be built using electro-mechanical relays as was used in the 1970's.

 

FAT or file allocation tables were developed in the late 1960's (long before Microsoft - a new kid on the block, & most certainly not hardware aware, but definitely business aware) to control data stored on spinning storage devices & are still used to this day.

 

In case you are wondering how old I am, I was fortunate/or unfortunate to be what is now known as a whizz kid, but back then in the 1960's I often struggled to be accepted by my companies customers - sometimes growing facial hair to make myself look older.

 

Of course these days I don't really care, it's either looking like Santa or clean shaven.

 

Ray.

[MyPC8MyBrain 273]

take a healthy magnet to it; and call it a day